Toge 1x1

Malte

Maximum Pace
Sep 26, 2011
496
54
48
Tokyo
#1
I looked up some great tours here on TCC and the stories are always referring to x-toge, y-toge, z-toge, ... names.
Now I have a hard time locating these on google map. I wounder is there a list somewhere with exact location?

For example:
* I couldn't locate Kaminikkawa-toge, or
* It looks Matsushime-toge is at inconsistent referred to at different places, or
* Why is the mountain road around Mt. Jimba called Wada-toge? ...

help please :eek:
 
Jun 9, 2011
241
1
36
tokyo
#3
it's is usually easy to find mountain passes if you know the correct japanese name.

上日川峠 (lots of results, but the first one is the place)
松姫峠 (result puts you in the right area. if you zoom in, the pass is labeled on the map)

陣馬山 (Mt. Jimba) is the name of the mountain, 和田峠 (wada-toge) is the name of one of the mountain passes near Mt. Jimba.

Does that help at all?
 

stanc

Maximum Pace
Sep 4, 2011
255
41
58
Brighton
#4
Supplementary Question

What are these roads like in Late March/early April? Is there still snow around? I ask because I hope to be in the area then but icy roads scare the S&!t out of me since I broke my hip.

P.s. I'm learning Japanese here. Since joining the board I have learnt what rindo & toge mean :)
 
May 22, 2007
3,564
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Kawasaki
halffastcycling.com
#5
I find this one a useful reference

Cyber-Cyclist's Pass Guide

Kaminikkawa-tōge (上日川峠) is the eighth in the list under Yamanashi-ken (山梨県)

Your quest is confounded by inconsistent spellings/renderings into English in some cases. But check out the TCC Hall of Fame for some with their maps and official start/end points.

As for why it's called "Wada-tōge" - that's because it passes through the Wada Forest [ref].

Passes are rarely named after the mountain peaks between which they pass. Mt. Jinba has Wada-tōge. Mt. Takao has Ōtarumi-toge. Mts. Ōyama/Asama/Takenodai have Yabitsu-tōge, etc.

You'll also find some anomalies, e.g., a TCC ride purporting to ride "Tomin-no-mori" (Forest of the (Tokyo) Citizens) will almost certainly go past the park bearing that name up to the peak at Kazahari-tōge, some 2km further along the road, and quite possibly down the other side. But that might be easily confused with a ride up the altogether more cliff-like Kazahari-rindō, which finishes at the same peak.
 
May 22, 2007
3,564
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Kawasaki
halffastcycling.com
#6
What are these roads like in Late March/early April?
It very much depends on the topography of the specific road and its surroundings, plus recent weather.

You can get an idea from the Toge ice log thread, and watch out for a new one with reports from Prince Ludwig the Indestructible and other rindō heroes. (Regrettably KoriBeyer has left for new pastures...)
 
Jun 9, 2011
241
1
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tokyo
#7
I was thinking about winter conditions while I was out on my last ride. the national roads service and most of the prefectural governments have online resources for mountain passes and forest roads, but I haven't done a winter riding season where I've tried to reference them yet. it looks like places further north that get lots of snow have the most detail. has anyone used the any of the government road conditions info services in winter?
 

stanc

Maximum Pace
Sep 4, 2011
255
41
58
Brighton
#8
Sorry to make everyone think of the grotty months ahead :) Thanks Mike. I've had a read of the toge ice log & will keep up with this years one once its started. I do have a flight booked but nothing else yet. I will be around from March 17th to April 11th. I've visited at this time of year before so know what the weather is like in Tokyo, Kyoto & Okayama.
 

Malte

Maximum Pace
Sep 26, 2011
496
54
48
Tokyo
#9
Thanks for the links, its a very good start.

Although by no means easily accesible, the following site lists about 2000 toges in Japan with pictures:
http://www.yuugao.jp/tougeoyaji/tougecollection.htm
Unfortunately it seems that there are no Toges for Yamanashi, also Kanagawa is only slightly covered :eek:uch:

it's is usually easy to find mountain passes if you know the correct japanese name.
So the approach would be "English TCC Name" --> "Kanji" --> Google Maps Location".
I works sometimes, just tried with Wada but there was no hint with google maps.
Another problem is that I would like to know the toge name of the road that I have been actually ridden.
"Goggle Map Location" -??-> "Toge Name"

For example I rode 518 and I wounder what the name is? "Cyber-Cyclist's Pass Guide (CCPG)" refers to it as "makime toge" but if I google "牧馬峠" the position is above yamanakako. This is again referred by CCPG as Yamabushi-Toge. :confused::confused:

This is awesome page, you can explore the passes on google maps and get names and ride information. Unfortunately it seems not to be updated anymore.

But check out the TCC Hall of Fame for some with their maps and official start/end points.
That is also a good start, unfortunate the www.bikely.com links don't work anymore for me :eek:uch:.
Related to this: I wounder if www.strava.com would be a more dynamic way to maintain and update the TCC Hall of Fame ?!?
 
May 22, 2007
3,564
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Kawasaki
halffastcycling.com
#10
For example I rode 518 and I wounder what the name is? "Cyber-Cyclist's Pass Guide (CCPG)" refers to it as "makime toge" but if I google "牧馬峠" the position is...
It's written on the Google Map.

If I search Google for 牧馬峠 the first result is the Wikipedia page for the pass on Kanagawa r518.

If one then clicks on Maps it gets confusing. The pass names are not generally registered as POI (Points of Interest) in Google Maps, even though the labels are there on the map.

Hence the Wikipedia pages and pass guides. If it's not out there, you have to do it yourself.

You can try the same trick with mikuni-tōge 三国峠 - there are at least three passes with that name accessible by bicycle within a day's ride of Tokyo, but it's also a generic expression for a point where three border lines meet at a pass, so there are dozens around the country. None of them are registered as points on Google Maps, but where there are facilities nearby (with advertising budgets) you might find a clue. Or not.

Related to this: I wounder if www.strava.com would be a more dynamic way to maintain and update the TCC Hall of Fame ?!?
Could be, but we'd need it to be a captive version otherwise the interference from people with motorbikes and a GPS would get nasty.
 

TOM

Maximum Pace
#12
Geocoding

I use Geocoding to get the longitude & latitude coordinates whenever I want to pinpoint the destination of a ride. It is easy to enter these coordinates in the Garmin Edge 800 and then let the device calculate the shortest way to get there. Inexplicably, my Edge 800 has been performing very well lately - no more sudden shutdowns and battery life improved. Quite satisfied now!
 

Ludwig

Speeding Up
Oct 9, 2008
871
0
36
Setagaya-ku, Tokyo
#13
My preferred approach has been to explore every road, rindo or pass I could possibly find on a map (printed or otherwise) or even on satellite images :D and learn about all the toge the hard way. It allowed me to always discover something new, for three years in a row. :cool: Meaning - there are a lot of toge to tackle!
 

Ludwig

Speeding Up
Oct 9, 2008
871
0
36
Setagaya-ku, Tokyo
#14
As for winter/early spring cycling, basically all roads within a day's ride from Tokyo are open all year. Most rindos are officially closed, but still passable. There are typically only a few days a year when new snow fall makes it difficult to navigate some of the smaller roads (or bigger roads at higher altitude), or indeed rindos which don't get cleared.

I think about the only rindo to avoid when snow fall starts is Kaminikkawa. It's at a higher altitude than any other rindo easily reachable from Tokyo and where the sun does not reach throughout the day, the snow stays for a long time. Of course this does not mean I wouldn't have waded through the snow at some point...:angel: Or indeed that some people wouldn't think this wasn't a great spot for shooting porn movies in the snow, as Tom discovered to his horror (?).
 

Malte

Maximum Pace
Sep 26, 2011
496
54
48
Tokyo
#15
I had some time and a glass of wine and created a Google map with the toge's that are frequently mentioned here on TCC and are in the west of Tokyo >>here<<.

The List currently has:
Arima Toge (1144m) 有馬峠
Ashigara Toge (759m) 足柄峠
Gando Toge (787m) 巌道峠
Mikuni Toge (1168m) 三国峠
Inugoeji (941m) 犬越路
Kazahari Toge (1146m) 風張峠
Makime Toge (420m) 牧馬峠
Matsuhime Toge (1249m) 松姫峠ま
Ni-ju-magari Toge (1152m) 二十曲峠
O-toge (1560m) 大峠
Otarumi Toge (392m) 大垂水峠
Sakawaki Toge (1179m) 坂脇峠
Tsuru Toge (873m) 鶴峠
Kaminikkawa Toge (1589m) 上日川峠
Wada Toge (690m) 和田峠
Yanagisawa Toge (1472m) 柳沢峠
Yamabushi Toge (1107m) 山伏峠
Yabitsu Toge (761m) ヤビツ峠
Sadamine Toge (616m) 定峰峠
Shiraishi Toge (764m) 白石峠
Umenoki Toge (627m) 梅野木峠
Iriyama Toge (585m) 入山峠
Shida Toge (304m) 志田峠
Hanbara Goe (487m) 半原越
Karasawa Rindo (612m) 唐沢林道
Tochiyasakazawa Rindo (601m)栃谷坂沢林道
 

m o b

Speeding Up
Jun 22, 2008
341
23
38
Bremen
cyclitis.wordpress.com
#16
More information and different names for the same toge are mentioned here:

http://positivo-espresso.blogspot.com/p/postivo-espresso-hall-of-fame-togebaka.html

At least "Jeromes Hill", Imagawa Toge, Odarumi Toge, Sasago Toge, Nokogiriyama, Kazahari Rindo, Karibazaka, Mitsumine and Tsuchisaka Toge as eaily accesible Toge from Tokyo would come to my mind. And there are many, many more in the Chichibu area.

There are at least two Yamabushi Toge (one at Doshi Michi and one in Chichibu ) and two Mikuni Toge (one at Yamanakako and the other one bordering Chichibu as well).
 

TOM

Maximum Pace
#17
Or indeed that some people wouldn't think this wasn't a great spot for shooting porn movies in the snow, as Tom discovered to his horror (?).
Let's say I was enormously amused (there was no snow around - although optically-speaking that would have accentuated the lady's fur coat better). Andy W. has enjoyed similar views in Niigata ;).

BTW, Kamihikawa-toge and not Kaminikkawa-toge is the more generally-accepted reading of 上日川峠 :)
 

TOM

Maximum Pace
#19
Just curious - where do you have this knowledge from?

A taxi driver from Enzan who is going up there frequently once lectured me it was definitely NOT Kamihikawa, but Kaminikkawa.
For instance the Yamanashi Tourism Organization is just one of the many "authorities" spelling out the name as かみひかわ. Also, the official name of the dam is Kamihikawa Dam...

Your taxi driver most likely got it correct in the local dialect so if you go for oysters and I go for oysters, I'll order oysters and cancel the oysters. Let's call the whole thing off :D