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Race The Training Thread

andywood

Maximum Pace
Apr 8, 2008
3,203
3,411
Another week of training done.

Poor weather but I did 3 big rides in the wind and rain.

Each weekend when I ride with the guys, I notice the difference. Felt strong today and hopefully tomorrow too.

The usual training blog link and cut and paste below.

Cheers, Andy



「2,250km in 3 weeks」

last week's training blog
先週のトレーニングブログです
変な日本語すみません!

the first 3 weeks of march
☆week 1 700km (4,000m)
☆week 2 800km (4,000m)
☆week 3 755km (5,000m)
3月の最初の3週間
☆1週目700km(4,000m)
☆2週目800km(4,000m)
☆3週目755km(5,000m)

each week I do two interval rides
a group ride
and some volume rides
毎週2回のインターバルライドをして
グループライドもして
その以外はボリュームライド

last week HIIT intervals & SST intervals
先週のHIITインターバルとSSTインターバル

☆Monday: road 80km, 300m
☆Tuesday: road 110km, 1,700m
☆Wednesday: HIIT intervals 70km, 300m
☆Thursday: SST intervals 100km, 500m
☆Friday: road 140km, 600m
☆Saturday: road 100km, 700m
☆Sunday: road 155km, 1,000m

the fitness is gradually increasing in strava
ストラバを見ると
フィットネスはどんどん上がっている

but sensations on the bike are more important:
☆higher cadence
☆climbing in a bigger gear
☆closing gaps
しかし、バイクの感覚はもっと重要ですね:
☆より高いケイデンス
☆より大きなギアで登る
☆ギャップを閉めやすくなる

each week I feel I am getting stronger
bring on the gravel!
毎週は少しでも強くなっていると感じています
グラベルシーズンはもうちょっとだ!

☆ Rapha Prestige Sanjo (May)
☆Gururin 200km (June)
☆ GRV Stage 1 Hakuba Gravel Fest (June)
☆ GRV Stage 2 Bikes Beach Bergs, Kashiwazaki (July)
☆ GRV Stage 3 Gran Fondo Myoko (September)

keep on keeping on!
がんばりましょう!

#hakubagravelfest #bikesbeachbergs #gfmyoko #ridejapan #berdspokes #astutowheels #teamimezi #imezi #imezi167 #167grv #imezisealant #プロジェクト167 #exlub #cycleshopjyonnobitime #raphaprestige
 

andywood

Maximum Pace
Apr 8, 2008
3,203
3,411
Your rides sound fun…

I skipped today’s race because my throat is sore. Sigh…

Do you take vitamin C, multi vitamins?

I mentioned it on this site before, but I think the Neil Med sinus rinse is a game changer for allergies and for cold prevention.

I haven't had a cold for 2 or 3 years.

Andy

サイナスリンス スターターキット(10包入り)ニールメッド Amazon product
 

baribari

Maximum Pace
May 28, 2010
1,394
1,017
Do you take vitamin C, multi vitamins?

I mentioned it on this site before, but I think the Neil Med sinus rinse is a game changer for allergies and for cold prevention.

I haven't had a cold for 2 or 3 years.

Andy

サイナスリンス スターターキット(10包入り)ニールメッド Amazon product

I never got sick until I moved in to my wife's family's house.
I suspect it might just be adult onset pollen allergies, since (I think) my last two sore throats came during pollen seasons and I rarely have a fever.
Should really get some allergen tests done...

Went on a long walk with my wife and some friends said I was looking slimmer.
Bumping my percentage of calories as protein way up seems to be working.
 

andywood

Maximum Pace
Apr 8, 2008
3,203
3,411
I never got sick until I moved in to my wife's family's house.
I suspect it might just be adult onset pollen allergies, since (I think) my last two sore throats came during pollen seasons and I rarely have a fever.
Should really get some allergen tests done...

Went on a long walk with my wife and some friends said I was looking slimmer.
Bumping my percentage of calories as protein way up seems to be working.

I had an allergen test.

Allergy to grass, Japanese cedar pollen, house dust (mites) amongst others. I too used to be particularly bad when we stayed in my wife's house or in friend's tatami rooms.

Now I take bepotasuchin antihistamines and a nasal spray. Together with the nasal rinse I can manage the symptoms quite well.

Definitely recommend taking the test.

Andy
 

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andywood

Maximum Pace
Apr 8, 2008
3,203
3,411
A blog here about the kind of group rides we do here on the weekend.

Limited to the coast before the snow melts, we try to make it as fun as possible.

Andy

 
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baribari

Maximum Pace
May 28, 2010
1,394
1,017
I rejoined Zwift and have done a few rides with my super fast friends.
With ~13 kg of handicap, I can put up a pretty good fight. Hahaha.
This is arguably better training than doing lukewarm TR workouts...

I got under 88 kg yesterday. I think the fat loss that had been obscured by creatine is just now showing up on the scale.
I will probably start taking it again next week after my MTB race.

I was so successful in my diet yesterday that I had a hard time eating enough.
Our family meals have laughably small portions considering that I weigh twice as much as three fifths of the family.
 

andywood

Maximum Pace
Apr 8, 2008
3,203
3,411
Another blog post of today's ride.

I was thinking of just a big volume ride today and some intervals tomorrow, but my teammate wanted to do some hillclimb repeats in the mix today.

I was like a nodding dog at work tonight!

Andy

 

andywood

Maximum Pace
Apr 8, 2008
3,203
3,411
Another week of training done. In terms of volume, probably the biggest week this week and biggest month this month, that I've ever done.

Gravel riding starts in mid April when we'll start to reccy this year's gravel courses.

The usual blog link and cutvideo paste below.

Cheers, Andy



「a big 4 weeks before the gravel training starts」

last week's training blog
先週のトレーニングブログです
変な日本語すみません!

another big week of training
mostly volume
☆975km
just 45 minutes of hard work
☆400W x 5 mins x 3
☆365W x 10 mins x 3
また大きなトレーニングウイークでした
主にボリューム
☆975km
わずか45分のハードワーク
☆400W×5分×3
☆365W×10分×3

☆Monday: road 100km, 400m
☆Tuesday: road 170km, 800m
☆Wednesday: 5 min intervals, 200km, 1,800m
☆Thursday: recovery 75km, 500m
☆Friday: 10 min intervals, 130km, 400m
☆Saturday: road 110km, 550m
☆Sunday: road 200km, 1,000m

the first 4 weeks of march
☆week 1 700km (4,000m)
☆week 2 800km (4,000m)
☆week 3 755km (5,000m)
☆week 4 975km (5,500m)
3月の最初の4週間
☆1週目700km(4,000m)
☆2週目800km(4,000m)
☆3週目755km(5,000m)
☆4週目975km(5,500m)

probably the hardest block of training I've ever done
still lots of time before the racing starts
but the gravel riding starts in April!
おそらく今までのトレーニングで一番大きいトレーニングブロックです
レースが始まる前のはまだまだ
でも4月にグラベルライドスタート!

※Training rides
☆Sanjo gravel (April 17)
☆Kashiwazaki BBB gravel (April 24)

※Races
☆ Rapha Prestige Sanjo (May)
☆Gururin 200km (June)
☆ GRV Stage 1 Hakuba Gravel Fest (June)
☆ GRV Stage 2 Bikes Beach Bergs, Kashiwazaki (July)
☆ GRV Stage 3 Gran Fondo Myoko (September)

keep on keeping on!
がんばりましょう!

#hakubagravelfest #bikesbeachbergs #gfmyoko #ridejapan #berdspokes #astutowheels #teamimezi #imezi #imezi167 #167grv #imezisealant #プロジェクト167 #exlub #cycleshopjyonnobitime #raphaprestige
 

OreoCookie

Maximum Pace
Dec 2, 2017
2,092
1,803
You’re firing on all cylinders, @andywood! Great work.

Just a quick question for y’all: on my weekend ride I took advantage of the nice weather and ventured into the mountains for the first time since late November. It was really nice and relaxing. Predictably, I got a little overexcited and pushed my ride more into lower tempo rather than endurance. However, my heart rate stayed in Z2. Even on a segment where my average power was close to FTP, my average heart rate stayed at 153 bpm. Strava claims I only spent 3 % of my time in HR Z4 and 18 % in HR Z3. For the record, I felt great on the bike and no fatigue. On the other hand, threshold workouts tell me that my current FTP is accurate within a few W.

Should I change my HR targets for endurance rides?
 

andywood

Maximum Pace
Apr 8, 2008
3,203
3,411
You’re firing on all cylinders, @andywood! Great work.

Just a quick question for y’all: on my weekend ride I took advantage of the nice weather and ventured into the mountains for the first time since late November. It was really nice and relaxing. Predictably, I got a little overexcited and pushed my ride more into lower tempo rather than endurance. However, my heart rate stayed in Z2. Even on a segment where my average power was close to FTP, my average heart rate stayed at 153 bpm. Strava claims I only spent 3 % of my time in HR Z4 and 18 % in HR Z3. For the record, I felt great on the bike and no fatigue. On the other hand, threshold workouts tell me that my current FTP is accurate within a few W.

Should I change my HR targets for endurance rides?

I think zone 2 riding is the easiest level of intensity to perceive. So you don't need to look at your computer so often, especially on a flat course. If you enter the hills you will be looking more. I tend to just look at ball park numbers eg. 120 on the flat, 140 on a climb. So maybe rather than thinking about the zones, where they overlap and how broad they are, just have a few target numbers in your mind.

For intervals, I would focus on power. The heart rate would just give me an indication of freshness.

Last week I did 365 W x 10 mins x 3.

Screenshot_20220329-090228_Strava.jpg

This is Z4 power and just 10W below threshold.

The HR response is less though and only touches Z4 >166HR at the end of the last interval.

Screenshot_20220329-090153_Strava.jpg

So power Z4, HR Z3.

I am happy with that in training. Tired but not too tired.

On TT race day, with fresh legs and a proper warm up (x 3 short efforts at high cadence will make your HR response quicker), I would expect an extra 10bpm and to be building quickly to 174HR.

So both power and HR corresponding closely.

Don't know if this answers the question or not!?

Andy
 

baribari

Maximum Pace
May 28, 2010
1,394
1,017
You’re firing on all cylinders, @andywood! Great work.

Just a quick question for y’all: on my weekend ride I took advantage of the nice weather and ventured into the mountains for the first time since late November. It was really nice and relaxing. Predictably, I got a little overexcited and pushed my ride more into lower tempo rather than endurance. However, my heart rate stayed in Z2. Even on a segment where my average power was close to FTP, my average heart rate stayed at 153 bpm. Strava claims I only spent 3 % of my time in HR Z4 and 18 % in HR Z3. For the record, I felt great on the bike and no fatigue. On the other hand, threshold workouts tell me that my current FTP is accurate within a few W.

Should I change my HR targets for endurance rides?
Power zones and HR zones don't align perfectly. I wouldn't overthink it.
Also, HR zones based on your LTHR are probably more useful than those based on max HR.
 

OreoCookie

Maximum Pace
Dec 2, 2017
2,092
1,803
Power zones and HR zones don't align perfectly. I wouldn't overthink it.
Also, HR zones based on your LTHR are probably more useful than those based on max HR.
That makes sense. Although, I reckon LTHR changes with fitness. I have had that happen last year when I PRed a very competitive climb: 6:50 minutes at 117 % FTP. Yet my average heart rate was only 159 bpm. That's within the range when I do threshold stuff (155–165 bpm).
 

andywood

Maximum Pace
Apr 8, 2008
3,203
3,411
I've always based HR zones around LTHR.

I don't think you can really raise your LTHR.

The old school 220 minus your age is not far off for me.

When I used to do hillclimb races, I would lock onto 180HR for an hour. Nowadays, 170HR would maybe be a target (though I'd have to go out and test it).

Rather than raising your LTHR, as you become fitter your physiological systems adapt. Your heart will pump more blood per beat for example. This is why your resting HR will be lower.

The fact that LTHR just declines slowly with age is one reason why FTP is important as you have a number which you can try to increase over time.

Andy
 

OreoCookie

Maximum Pace
Dec 2, 2017
2,092
1,803
The fact that LTHR just declines slowly with age is one reason why FTP is important as you have a number which you can try to increase over time.
The thing is that my heart rate at certain power levels fluctuates quite a bit over the course of a season. So initially my heart rate will be in the mid-130s when I am in a recovery valley on a trainer. Now it can dip below 120 bpm at times (provided the rest interval is long enough). My RPE more often than not follows heart rate, so e. g. the threshold effort at one of the climbs felt easy. (I also tried not to go overboard and trying to beat my PR that day — it was too windy anyway ;))

Basically, I am interested in this question, because I no longer have a power meter on my mountain bike (the unit I bought was a dud) and I need to pace by heart rate. Now if 135ish bpm is already tempo, I should slow down a bit and set my heart rate limits differently for my endurance rides.
 

andywood

Maximum Pace
Apr 8, 2008
3,203
3,411
Your heart rate will decrease for a given amount of effort as your fitness increases. The flipside of this is that you are generating more power at the same HR, so you adjust your power zones accordingly. The heart rate zones by comparison are relatively fixed.

You are right that perception will be close to what HR you are seeing. So 135HR will feel the same but the power you are generating will vary depending on your fitness throughout the year.

If you need to work out a target HR, why not ride at the desired power for 30 minutes, lap the last 20 and record the average HR.

Andy
 

andywood

Maximum Pace
Apr 8, 2008
3,203
3,411
Another week of training done.

The gravel is opening up. My gravel bike went into hospital this week. It reminds me that it's important to have more than one bike. Or more importantly a stash of spares for when accidents occur.

The usual training blog link and cut and paste below.

Cheers, Andy



「gravel transition mission abort!」

last week's training blog
先週のトレーニングブログです
変な日本語すみません!

after a 4 week big training block
I wanted to switch to gravel riding last week
4週間の大きなトレーニングブロックの後
先週はグラベルライディングにスイッチしたかった

the first and last gravel sectors of June's BBB Bikes Beach Bergs
are open!
6月のBBB「バイクス、ビーチ、バーグズ」の最初と最後のグラベルセクターはオープン!

on tuesday
on the last gravel section
a branch in the wheel
it broke a spoke and the derailleur
火曜日に
最後のグラベルセクションで
枝がホイールに入って
スポークとディレイラーを壊しました

back to road work then
2 sets of intervals
☆HIIT 500~520W x 30s x 10 x 3
☆FTP 370W x 10 mins x 2
volume
and 2 group rides
ロードワークに戻りました
インターバルx2
☆HIIT500〜520W x 30s x 10 x 3
☆FTP370W×10分×2
ボリューム
2つのグループライド

☆Monday: gravel 75km, 1,000m
☆Tuesday: gravel 45km, 600m
☆Wednesday: road HIIT intervals, 35
km, 150m
☆Thursday: road 100km, 300m
☆Friday: road FTP intervals, 100km, 550m
☆Saturday: road 140km, 1,000m
☆Sunday: road 140km, 1,000m

☆☆☆630km, 4,500m, 23h

saturday and sunday are 140km group rides
on saturday it is great to see Gen learning so quickly
a natural talent!
土曜日と日曜日は140kmのグループライドでした
土曜日にGenがこんなに早く学んでいるのを見るのは素晴らしいことでした
自然な才能!

on sunday the legs are dead
it's great to have Yamada san to help me cut the wind
日曜日に足が死んでいる
山田さんが風を切るのを手伝ってくれて
素晴らしいことでした!
自然な才能!

this week I'll meet Kashiwazaki city officials
GURURIN KASHIWAZAKI - we'll have a 200km road event in June
after that
BIKES BEACH BERGS KASHIWAZAKI - a 110km mixed surface event in July
今週は柏崎市のオフィシャルとミーティングをします
6月のぐるりん柏崎200kmのロードイベントの後に
7月BIKES BEACHBERGS柏崎の110kmのグラベルイベントがやりますよ!

※Training rides
☆Sanjo gravel (April 17)
☆Kashiwazaki BBB gravel (April 24)
☆Sanjo Gravel (May 15)

※Races
☆ Rapha Prestige Sanjo (May)
☆Gururin Kashiwazaki 200km (June)
☆ GRV Stage 1 Hakuba Gravel Fest (June)
☆ GRV Stage 2 Bikes Beach Bergs, Kashiwazaki (July)
☆ GRV Stage 3 Gran Fondo Myoko (September)

keep on keeping on!
がんばりましょう!

#hakubagravelfest #bikesbeachbergs #gfmyoko #ridejapan #berdspokes #astutowheels #teamimezi #imezi #imezi167 #167grv #imezisealant #プロジェクト167 #exlub #cycleshopjyonnobitime #raphaprestige
 

andywood

Maximum Pace
Apr 8, 2008
3,203
3,411
Some words and images from two group rides this weekend.

Great weather for it!

Andy

 

baribari

Maximum Pace
May 28, 2010
1,394
1,017
Random thoughts:

Three hours of mountain bike racing destroyed my lower back for several days, but zone 2 workouts have never felt easy as it does now. Hehe.

Outdoor road riding season has finally begun around here. After two good days of riding, I actually gained two and a half kilos. I hope it's just water weight.

I am signed up to do Gunma for the first time this month.

After switching my indoor bike from my egg beaters back to road pedals, I'm getting knee issues again.
Hmm. I wonder if I shouldn't just buy another pedal of egg beaters for the trainer. I am curious what the cause is. Might need to follow's Andy's example and do some lunges instead of squats, since I think my left leg is a bit weaker.

I switched my 120 mm stem out for a 100, since I pushed my seat back quite a bit, and that seems to have helped with my neck and hand issues a bit. I am still not entirely sure why I was put on a 120 in the first place...
 

adventurous cyclist

turtle speed cyclist
May 16, 2019
1,028
1,106
After switching my indoor bike from my egg beaters back to road pedals, I'm getting knee issues again.
Not sure how old you are , but I'm nearing 69 and yes, knee issues are a great concern to me. In my experience knees issues come and go as long as ,well,... this is why I call myself " turtle speed cyclist ' on the forum. Knees issues are for real once you get up there in age, but a friend of mine is up in age and cycles fast to where I just tell him, this is how I go. Does he wait up for me. NO So I guess everyone is different . This may sound a bit off the wall, but can vinegar help with this? https://www.thehealthsite.com/home-...ar-for-knee-pain-try-it-to-believe-it-775024/
 
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