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Race The Training Thread

OreoCookie

Maximum Pace
Dec 2, 2017
2,216
1,926
I just did my FTP test, I’m now at 328 W (or 4.44 W/kg since my average weight this month is 73.8 kg)! I think I could have held on a few more seconds (10? 20?), but as usual, my mind checked out when the new step started and I knew I was happy with that. Perhaps I should aim for 20:10 minutes instead of 20:00 minutes.

But overall, I’m very happy, this is 2 W shy of my year’s goal, and it looks like by the end of the next block I will have a good chance of surpassing that. I haven’t lost much weight (I’m fluctuating between 73.5 and 74.2 kg), just about a kilo-and-a-half since January (and most of that I have lost since May), but my body fat has been on a downward trend since April (averaging about 15.7 % this month). For hill climbs I should lose some more kilos, as @baribari can attest, there is still a bit of belly fat left. But for crits, I think the current weight is fine.
 

OreoCookie

Maximum Pace
Dec 2, 2017
2,216
1,926
This morning I was basically 90 kg again. This seems to happen after every race.
It took me two days to bounce back weight-wise. I lost 1.6 kg despite drinking a ton (including 1.5 liters of coke!). I felt a bit dehydrated yesterday, I had a tinge of a headache. So I drank lots of ice water with electrolyte tabs. Worked well. I had quite a bit of carbs for dinner yesterday and felt satisfied. Plus, I went on a light spin yesterday after dropping off my daughter at day care. Just a bit over 40 minutes and I was deliberately very slow. That worked great.
 

baribari

Maximum Pace
May 28, 2010
1,421
1,051
Tonight's VO2 max session was laughably easy. I don't know why TrainerRoad thinks it needs to dial my workouts down so aggressively after an FTP bump.
 

OreoCookie

Maximum Pace
Dec 2, 2017
2,216
1,926
Tonight's VO2 max session was laughably easy. I don't know why TrainerRoad thinks it needs to dial my workouts down so aggressively after an FTP bump.
That’s my experience as well. It seems they got a bit burned by vocal feedback that their previous plans were too hard. On the previous cycle I have to manually add some stretch workouts to get the levels right. Fortunately, my levels were not set to 0 and it seems I have two “stretch” workouts in my plan this week, presumably to check my levels. (They look very reasonable to me, ask me again on Sunday.)
 

baribari

Maximum Pace
May 28, 2010
1,421
1,051
That’s my experience as well. It seems they got a bit burned by vocal feedback that their previous plans were too hard. On the previous cycle I have to manually add some stretch workouts to get the levels right. Fortunately, my levels were not set to 0 and it seems I have two “stretch” workouts in my plan this week, presumably to check my levels. (They look very reasonable to me, ask me again on Sunday.)
It's especially funny considering I was at 6.6 for VO2max before my bump, which was the highest of all my levels.
I am starting to think I should just ignore the adaptations unless they make the workouts harder.

This morning my resting heart rate was 44... Perhaps the benefits of racing in the heat. Haha.
 

OreoCookie

Maximum Pace
Dec 2, 2017
2,216
1,926
It's especially funny considering I was at 6.6 for VO2max before my bump, which was the highest of all my levels.
I am starting to think I should just ignore the adaptations unless they make the workouts harder.
I wouldn’t ignore them completely. You also have to pay a little attention to whether a workout is meant to be achievable (= easy) or productive (= harder). Since this isn’t marked directly in the calendar, the progression levels of certain workouts made no sense to me until I noticed this pattern.

My plan is to help AT along resetting progression levels if possible. It is less important for workouts you don’t actually do (e. g. endurance or sprint don’t matter unless you do endurance or sprint work).
 

baribari

Maximum Pace
May 28, 2010
1,421
1,051
I wouldn’t ignore them completely. You also have to pay a little attention to whether a workout is meant to be achievable (= easy) or productive (= harder). Since this isn’t marked directly in the calendar, the progression levels of certain workouts made no sense to me until I noticed this pattern.

My plan is to help AT along resetting progression levels if possible. It is less important for workouts you don’t actually do (e. g. endurance or sprint don’t matter unless you do endurance or sprint work).
If you do an "Achievable" and mark it as easy, you get a bump of about 0.2, but if you are able to do a "Stretch" or above you get a boost of 3.0 or more even if it was very hard.
 

baribari

Maximum Pace
May 28, 2010
1,421
1,051
Did a park criterium in Utsunomiya. It was tough. I did 312 normalized for 18 minutes. I am pretty sure that's a record for NP. And that was just enough to stay more or less with the front group until the last lap. I have no idea how I actually finished as they only recorded the top three. Next time I think I will try to go off the front. Hehehe

It was fun, but I feel kind of silly driving four hours for an 18-minute race... That's probably the most expensive race I've done in terms of money spent per minute of racing.
 

andywood

Maximum Pace
Apr 8, 2008
3,232
3,442
A big volume of training for me last week as I focused on getting up and doing a few hours before breakfast.

Early mornings are a great way to beat the heat.

In the afternoon, a 2L frozen hydration back pack is a game changer. An extra 2kg on the climbs must also have a training effect!

The usual training blog link and cut and paste below.

Cheers, Andy



「goodbye july」

last 2 weeks' training blog
先々週と先週のトレーニングブログです
変な日本語すみません!

in the old days
to be competitive on the road
we used to aim for 2,000km a month
昔は自転車レースに出るように
「月に2,000kmを走るは必要」と言われた

for gravel you'd probably only need 1,000 or 1,500km
その考え方で
グラベルの場合、おそらく1,000kmから1,500km必要かな?

so july was another good training month
7月も良いトレーニング月でした

☆2,000km / 38,000m climbing

week 3 I got back on the road bike as well as the gravel bike
3週目ロードバイクとグラベルバイクも走りました

☆ week 3 445 km / 7,800 m

week 4 I did a few gravel rides before breakfast to add some volume
4週目朝食前にグラベルライドへ少しボリュームアップができました

☆ week 4 560 km / 11,500m climbing

a few events on the radar
レーダーにいくつかのイベントがある

☆jyonnobi 4h enduro, august 14
☆gf myoko september 18, 19
☆nobeyama gravel challenge october 30, 31
☆grinduro november 6th
☆2021/22 cyclocross season

here we go!
がんばります!

#berdspokes #astutowheels #teamimezi #imezi #imezi167 #167grv #imezisealant #プロジェクト167 #akagioffroadenduro #raphaprestige #grinduro #gfmyoko #nobeyamagravelchallenge
 

Nuff

Maximum Pace
Jul 28, 2020
130
126
Update for last 3 week block, I've been riding through the hottest part of the day, usually between 1pm to 3-4pm, except few exceptions (thunderstorms etc) I was mostly riding outside. My indoor FTP according to garmin was 263W and outside in the hit 250W, with my edge jumping between both of this values.

Week 1: 11.5 hours, 369 TSS
Week 2: 13.5 hours, 407 TSS
Week 3: 16 hours, 444 TSS

This block was pretty hard on my bad knee with the increased watts, although in week 3 it seemed to have accustomed to it and isn't causing me too many issues, except on vo2max day, so I've to cut down the number of intervals, also I had to scratch the idea of weight training because of this. Riding through the hottest part of the day proved challenging, but I'm getting acclimatised, although my power is still down compared to when it's cooler.

It's also been 1 year since I got my bike and joined here (plus started training), my initial FTP was 145W. I had number of set backs, but I'm pretty happy with 263W. I will have to see if I can get it to 300W+ by the end of this year.
 

OreoCookie

Maximum Pace
Dec 2, 2017
2,216
1,926
Wow, I’d like A 120 W gain in that time span, too! That’s seriously impressive.

Don't push yourself too hard, it takes time to build your aerobic engine. Brittle fitness isn’t what you should go for by pushing too hard. Focus on process goal, not outcome goals. Build good habits and have patience.
 

andywood

Maximum Pace
Apr 8, 2008
3,232
3,442
First time to look at my power meter since spring this morning.

20210803_073726.jpg

On the road bike. Start where I left off. 20 minute warm up. 15 mins x 3. A longer cool down.

Aiming for 340 to 350W. The power drops off each interval.

20210803_085403.jpg

This is despite a bigger physiological effort to stay in that zone each time.

(The third interval is by the sea with a tailwind which can also make it harder as I was spinning out the 52x11 at times).

20210803_085335.jpg

Pushed it over LTHR to finish. A good responsive HR after a rest day yesterday.

I will do some more efforts like this as I get ready for a 4h enduro in two weeks time.

Then I'll move on to shorter intervals to get ready for the CX season.

Andy
 

OreoCookie

Maximum Pace
Dec 2, 2017
2,216
1,926
I did a hard VO2max workout this morning, and thanks to sleeping in the living room with the AC on, I could actually sleep and felt good on the bike. Sleep and doing workouts with the AC on make such a big difference.

It looks like my goal of reaching 330 W this year will be ticked off very soon. Can't wait for the next ramp test. I'll try to continue on after the 20:00 mark and not just give up after the next power step.
 

Nuff

Maximum Pace
Jul 28, 2020
130
126
Wow, I’d like A 120 W gain in that time span, too! That’s seriously impressive.

Don't push yourself too hard, it takes time to build your aerobic engine. Brittle fitness isn’t what you should go for by pushing too hard. Focus on process goal, not outcome goals. Build good habits and have patience.
Thanks, just newbie gains at that point, my 5sec and 1min power dropped a lot as a trade. I expect the progress to get a lot slower from now on. Also I find my very flexible approach to polarised training works really well for me. Much better than the Sweet Spot from trainerroad which was always pretty hard on my bad knee and I felt burned out, now I'm feeling pretty fresh most of the time. I also found it really hard to motivate myself to do the SS rides or even worse over/unders. Lots of Z1/2 rides and once a week vo2max for when I'm up to it during the week.

Also I did lose 10kg, most of it happened when I switched to doing traditional base rides/polarised training. The extra volume burns calories. I'm at 3.65W/kg now. Once I'm closer to 4W/kg I'm going try to get some of my muscle back (really counting on my muscle memory here and 2 decades of lifting weights). One of the most obvious changes I see is that my back got a lot weaker and I can't hold the handlebars as solidly as I used to over a year ago when I try to sprint.
 

OreoCookie

Maximum Pace
Dec 2, 2017
2,216
1,926
@Nuff
Roughly speaking, your endurance in the lower zones take a lot longer to build than your power up high. The good news is that it will also stay with you for a long time. If you have the time, adding lots of Z2 rides is exactly the right way, although in combination with other workouts that raise your FTP somewhat. After all, what counts as Z2 will change as you get fitter.

You are right to point out that the going gets tougher the farther up you go. So you should temper your expectations, gains get harder and harder to come by. I wouldn't necessarily focus too much on getting over 300 W or 4 W/kg this season. I'd instead aim at being consistent in your training and lifestyle choices.

People like @andywood make it seem simple, but the truth of the matter is that what I think is most impressive is not his power numbers but his consistency. I found that once I got fitter, I really needed to make life style adjustments to make my training productive and manageable. Fortunately, in my experience you can enter a virtuous circle where your body tells you you want to lay off fried and fatty food and want to eat more vegetables and fruit.
 

baribari

Maximum Pace
May 28, 2010
1,421
1,051
I need to be more consistent, lift weights, stretch, and cross train, but by the end of the workday it's pretty hard to say no to a cold beer...

Guess I should just ride in the morning. Fasted rides in the morning might kill three birds with one stone (the desire to ride more, lose weight, and avoid the absurd heat recently).
 

andywood

Maximum Pace
Apr 8, 2008
3,232
3,442
@Nuff
Roughly speaking, your endurance in the lower zones take a lot longer to build than your power up high. The good news is that it will also stay with you for a long time. If you have the time, adding lots of Z2 rides is exactly the right way, although in combination with other workouts that raise your FTP somewhat. After all, what counts as Z2 will change as you get fitter.

You are right to point out that the going gets tougher the farther up you go. So you should temper your expectations, gains get harder and harder to come by. I wouldn't necessarily focus too much on getting over 300 W or 4 W/kg this season. I'd instead aim at being consistent in your training and lifestyle choices.

People like @andywood make it seem simple, but the truth of the matter is that what I think is most impressive is not his power numbers but his consistency. I found that once I got fitter, I really needed to make life style adjustments to make my training productive and manageable. Fortunately, in my experience you can enter a virtuous circle where your body tells you you want to lay off fried and fatty food and want to eat more vegetables and fruit.
Thanks, whenever we talk about training I always seem to say "consistency" and "specicity", so your post here motivated me to write a short essay on the six keywords of training! Check it out below.

Cheers, Andy

 

andywood

Maximum Pace
Apr 8, 2008
3,232
3,442
Another big training week last week.

The usual blog link and cut and paste below.

Cheers, Andy



「training overload」

last week's training blog
先週のトレーニングブログです
変な日本語すみません

another big week of training
I took monday off
and then went hard for 6 days
もう1つのビッグトレーニングウィークでした
月曜日はレストして
それから6日間のがんばること

☆monday: rest
☆tuesday: road intervals & gravel 100km / 900m
☆wednesday: gravel 85km / 1,700m
☆thursday: road intervals 90km / 300m
☆friday: gravel 60km / 1,300m
☆saturday: gravel & road 140km / 3,000m
☆sunday: road intervals 90km / 300m

※570km, 7,500m of climbing

lots of asaren before breakfast
hot even at 5am!
朝食前の朝練はメインですが
5時でも暑い!

on three days I did 15 mins x 3 intervals
3日間に15分x3のインターバルをしました
☆ TARGET 340〜350W

on saturday's group ride I felt great
on sunday's intervals I was a dead fish in the water!
土曜日のグループライドの時にコンディションが良かった
日曜日のインターバルライドの時に
水中で死んだ魚みたい!

training overload!
that's a good sign!
トレーニングの疲れですね!
それは良いことです!

#berdspokes #astutowheels #teamimezi #imezi #imezi167 #167grv #imezisealant #プロジェクト167 #akagioffroadenduro #raphaprestige #grinduro #gfmyoko #nobeyamagravelchallenge
 

andywood

Maximum Pace
Apr 8, 2008
3,232
3,442
Last week was supposed to be an easier week but I ended up doing more, just in terms of volume, than the previous two weeks.

One month till Gran Fondo Myoko.

The usual blog link and cut and paste below.

Cheers, Andy



「the 600 club」

last week's training blog
先週のトレーニングブログです
変な日本語すみません!

after two hard weeks of 580km
I decided to cut the volume last week
580km x 2 の2週間のハードトレーニングの後
先週はボリュームを下げる予定でした

tuesday and friday are rest days
saturday is a 4h enduro
火曜日と金曜日はレストデイになる
土曜日の4時間エンデューロのために

the weather changed
the first rain in a long time
the first sub 30 degrees in a long time
そして天気が変わった
久しぶりの雨
久しぶりのサブ30度

the 4h enduro was cancelled because of the rain
dangerous to ride gravel in the mountains
I hit the road bike
雨のため4時間のエンデューロはキャンセルされました
山のグラベルは危険から
ロードバイクに乗った

so easy to clock up miles on the road bike!
somehow 600km for the week
the 600 club!
ロードバイクでマイルをゲットするのは楽です!
なんとか一週間で600km
600クラブ!

☆monday: gravel 130km / 3,200m
☆tuesday: rest
☆wednesday: road intervals 70km / 300m
☆thursday: gravel / road, 100km / 1,700m
☆friday: rest
☆saturday: road 200km / 2,400m
☆sunday: road 100km / 500m

☆25h, 600km, 8,000m

the sunshine and hot weather returns from this week
time to get back on the gravel!
今週からサンシャインと暑い天気が戻ってきます
グラベルへも戻ります!

#berdspokes #astutowheels #teamimezi #imezi #imezi167 #167grv #imezisealant #プロジェクト167 #exlub #cycleshopjyonnobitime #akagioffroadenduro #raphaprestige #grinduro #gfmyoko #nobeyamagravelchallenge
#ajocc
 

OreoCookie

Maximum Pace
Dec 2, 2017
2,216
1,926
Got my FTP test back this morning, the doctor said it is 335 W (with a weight of about 72.6–73 kg that translates to 4.6 W/kg) :) That means I have reached one of my training goals for this season. Nice. And it looks like I could reach 340 W, too, my stretch goal. I still have quite a bit of body fat (averaging about 15.5 %), so I could stand to lose 2 kg or so. But I don‘t want to push that too much. I wish I could do some more riding outdoors, though. Recently, my schedule and the weather haven‘t been very conducive to riding outdoors.

I‘m thinking about what goals to set next season already. We have a little one on the way, ETA is 4 December. So I was thinking of putting more emphasis on my base and flexibility when it comes to training time.
 
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