Power people?

theBlob

Bokeh master
Sep 28, 2011
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#1
Few questions for you folks using power meters.

1) Out of curiosity what numbers are you looking at live when training? Ie what is on your garmin screen?

2) What analysis software are you using, I was looking at training peaks but it doesn't seem to run on a mac without messing about. Is anyone using anything else?
 
Jun 14, 2012
16
0
11
Tokyo
#2
Hi, key fields I use on my garmin are;
3 sec average power, cadence, HR, speed, distance, time, and normalized power for 5km.

Mainly use training peaks and WKO+
 

Doug3

Maximum Pace
Jun 24, 2010
720
179
63
Setagaya
www.tokyocyclingcoach.com
#3
For intervals I use 3 second and lap power.

For LT work I use 3 sec, 30 sec and lap power.

For recovery, 3 second with an alarm for high power.

Group rides, whatever.

Analysis with Training Peaks, WKO+ and Garmin Connect.
 

FarEast

Maximum Pace
May 25, 2009
5,528
538
193
Yokohama
#4
Average wattage
Current Wattage
Cadence

Everything else i don't need. Other Wattage calculations I do in my head or hit the lap button on climbs, or sprints.
 

Sikochi

Maximum Pace
Sep 13, 2010
1,174
67
68
Kochi
#6
Don`t forget that different powermeters send information differently. The quarq sends it per crank revolution whereas powertap is on a fixed time basis (i forget if it is every second or every 1.0X seconds) and hence, takes no account of crank revolutions, so those of us with powertaps have a greater need for powersmoothing. As for the setting, experiment to see what works for you and in relation to your training goals.

I don`t use it (as didn`t quite sync up properly with my device) but many people swear by Golden Cheetah (as GSAstuto mentioned)...and it`s free. I think the next version is due soon. My software came with my device, O-synce, but I now have a Joule 1.0, so will test out PowerAgent and Golden Cheetah.

Don`t forget, what`s most important is what to do with the numbers you see, not the numbers in and of themselves.
 

theBlob

Bokeh master
Sep 28, 2011
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#8
I downloaded golden cheetah and have started getting a feel for it. Of course by adding rides into it and starting to build my power profile.
My FTP is looking like about 285 from my first few tests, but we'll see what happens in the hills on saturday. I guess there is more information on the net but I really want to use the fatigue information to try and control myself and not overtrain.

I guess that is the Daniels score or something. Anyone know of good online sources of people using this software?
 

theBlob

Bokeh master
Sep 28, 2011
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#10
My first test was a 20 minute run. So I reduced the result by 5% But unfortunately there are a few spots on the course that require you stop peddling, But nevertheless, that is my regular course so it won't change so I will still be able to guage improvement against that result (On that course)

It's kind of hard to find a place to test on the road! 20 minutes without stopping peddling just doesn't happen in the city!

Today up shiraishi I was about 315W for 20minutes. But that is another thing too I guess.
 
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Sikochi

Maximum Pace
Sep 13, 2010
1,174
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Kochi
#13
My first test was a 20 minute run. So I reduced the result by 5%
Today up shiraishi I was about 315W for 20minutes. But that is another thing too I guess.
Don`t forget this and this (from Alex`s Cycle Blog).
Sin of Sins #6 – 95% of a 20-min mean maximal power = FTP
Well, this method of establishing FTP isn’t one of the listed Seven Deadly Sins in the first place, but it has become such a commonly referred to/utilised method (mainly due to its publication in the excellent book, Training and Racing with a Power Meter) that it gets its own SOS number.

Firstly, the main issue with this common Sin of Sins is that the ratio between 20-min power (or other similar shorter TT duration power) and FTP is not the same for everybody, and neither does the ratio remain static for an individual. One should recognise that due to several factors, not least of which is the contribution of anaerobic capacity and the exact protocol used (e.g. performing a pre-ride blowout effort), that the ratio is likely to be within a range and where someone is within that range is anyone’s guess.

So, FTP might be anywhere in the range of, say 90% to 98% of 20-min max average power. Personally, my FTP has been at both 92% and 96% of my then 20-min max average power. So, by all means use 95% of 20-min max power as a starting point but remember it may well be out by some margin and it would be wise to use an additional or alternative method to validate your FTP estimate.
***
Well done on the figures and welcome to the world of different flat and uphill FTPs!
 

theBlob

Bokeh master
Sep 28, 2011
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#15
Thanks for the comments guys.

Sikochi, I know the numbers aren't totally accurate, and I have just started using the PM, so I expect the numbers to change. Like he says consistancy is the key to any testing and removing as many variables. So as long as I keep my testing to the same course I should be able to gauge improvement or not as I go.
It is really interesting though and I am really enjoying using it and the knowledge I am picking up about cycling and myself as an athlete. ( Can I say that! I've never been one of them before ha ha ha)

I bought the before mentioned book and am only a chapter in so a lot of reading ahead of me!

James, I signed up for JCRC but haven't received anything from them, but I will be starting racing this year at some point probably sooner rather than later... Thanks for the push!!
 

GSAstuto

Maximum Pace
Oct 11, 2009
945
242
103
tokyo
www.roadfixie.com
#17
Good on you! At the end of the day riding out with a lag and back with a smile is awesome! Nothing feels better than a job well done. And if you toss a few hills in the mix - so be it. I find the power data intriguing as it relates to incremental improvements and pacing. I'm also somewhat vindicated that I can pretty much dial myself into whatever zone without requiring a computer. @James - right on! 'Data' is just data! If you are competitive then nothing satisfies like mano e mano. (Unless you're still stuck at WOW).
 

theBlob

Bokeh master
Sep 28, 2011
2,864
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#18
My PM gives power balance numbers. Here are a few things I have noticed, I'm not sure if there is any need to try and correct the discrepancies in power output.

on light recovery runs, I sit at very close to 50/50 (L/R)
In the saddle on a LT run about 48/52
But as I get tired I have seen the balance go as far as 46/54
Out of the saddle climbing back to 50/50.

I know I have a slightly different heel angle in both feet, mainly due to residual ankle ligament strength problems. Should I be trying to address the power discrepancy? Or just push on as is?
 

FarEast

Maximum Pace
May 25, 2009
5,528
538
193
Yokohama
#19
Perfectly normal!

Although looking at the numbers I can tell you right now you have poor standing form and you rock the bike a lot when out of the saddle, you are using soltely your body weight to power the bike and thus the 50/50 score.

You need to isolate the hips and brace the bike, preventing it from rocking left and right, it should be as steady as possible between your legs. Imagine you are
using a stair master workout machine. Ever wondered why on the bike climbs riders unzip their jersey and pull out the lucky charms?

It’s a pendulum and “if it’s rocking your form is shocking” the top pro's will have a rock steady bike under them with all the power being transfered in to driving the bike forward and up. It's only when they start to hit the wall that you'll see the bike come lose under them.

It always makes me laugh here in Japan when poeple compliment each other on thier "Dancing" when climbing, my old coach and mentor would shout at us to "STOP DANCING AND BLOODY RIDE!"

The video below gives you a basic overview of the technique

If you are unable to prevent the bike from rocking you may find that you put out more sustained power sitting, Froome and Wiggins are these type of riders, so now you have the power tap experiment and see what the numbers say. If you have more sustained power when standing and yet the bike is still all over the place under you then I suggest doing upper body strength workouts at the gym.
 
Likes: theBlob

FarEast

Maximum Pace
May 25, 2009
5,528
538
193
Yokohama
#20
LOL, what is this in response to?
Ahhh I was going to report that posts were not being uploaded - it seems there is an issue with having two windows displaying the TCC forums while making a response to a thread.

This was supposed to go in to the "Hello from Thailand" thread