Let's Get Down to the Nitty

Mar 10, 2014
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Funabashi, Chiba
#1
OK well it wasn't worded properly in the original whim, but well here it is:

What is a bike that's not your dream bike, and not a bike you own / have owned, but you'd be happy with as your only bike? Your N.

In other words, not the crazy sexy mistress (maybe emphasis on crazy??) or in other words your dream bike, but she could be your go to girl. You'll take her out, show her a nice time around town from time to time, introduce her to your friends. She's good looking but not a knockout, reliable maybe, trustworthy. She makes you feel good. She's your N!

edit:
For me? Maybe I'd be ok with at minimum something with a modern groupset, probably 105 level and up? No, maybe ULTEGRA if its Shimano is the lowest I could go.

Aluminum wheels are ok but I'd prefer no silver rim, completely black. So not compltelty stock. I'd say not anything from the AEON store or Asahi cycles, some of the endurance geometries don't do it for me. A saddle from fizik not bottom rung OEM. hmm I think I'd need to thik about it some more to be more specific.

Hmm now that I think about it it's a bit of a shit topic!!
 
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Mar 10, 2014
453
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Funabashi, Chiba
#2
Ok this is not a shit topic at all, I was just not answering the original question.

ULTEGRA. Pfft. Let’s stop right there. ULTEGRA is not the girl you take out and show around the town. ULTEGEA is the nice and ok looking but nothing more than a girl you date til the real one comes along. She’s not too high maintenance and she doesn’t mind staying home and watching you play PlayStation no need to take her out all the time. Filler! I’ve got ULTEGRA on my bike right now and I’ve nevr stood back and said, wow look at that sweet ass ULTEGRA sure am lucky to have her!

ULTEGRA is the one you date on the side, a second bike maybe not quite a hacky training bike if it’s new, but not all that all that.

If it’s Shimano, DURA ACE minimum. Di2, well if we’re going for the only one, your one and only prime baby it’s got to be at least DA. DA or Di2 ULTEGRA? Still gotta be DA!! lol. And I was talking the 105 shit to begin with gaaaah

Stay tuned for more, where I stand on other groupsets, frames, finishing pieces other details and this and that. Tell me what’s your minimum line. Doesn’t have to be the same!
 
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Mar 10, 2014
453
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Funabashi, Chiba
#3
I don’t know the details on CAMPAIGNS NOLO which I’ll call C from now on since it’s a bitch to spell but even I know that’s looks nice as fuck! Those cranks? The carbon everything? That’s dreambike territory. The one thing I don’t totally love about C is the shifters - kind of like you’re dating Rihanna or something and you look down and she’s got slightly weirdly shaped thumbs or something. Not a game changer by any means but still it’s there...

That Duper Rocord EPS is that it? Wow. But expensive as hell. Is it CHORUS that’s the equivalent to ULTEGRA? Well that would be fine for me, the C C groupset passes the test for me.
 
Mar 10, 2014
453
138
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Funabashi, Chiba
#4
If youre wondering why this is coming in bits it’s because I’m typing on a little iPhone SE it’s seriously ridiculous dealing with the phone auto correct and what is this the page auto correct? fighting all the time it gets annoying and if posts get too long I lose my place or even worse I’ve typed huge bunches and lost it somehow somewhere into internet vapor - sticking to the short posts for now sorry if it looks like spam once again.

So SRAM. RED? I guess we’ll put etap in the dream xategory for now. SRAM red or 1x if thats what you need that’s it for that. Of the groupset groups which do I take for my bike? I guess DA over C if it’s non Di2, sorry is that C over DA and if it’s Di2 then that. Did that make sense? You know what I mean.

SRAM RED? Meh. Ok. Not feeling it either way personally.

The other weird ones like ... now I’m forgetting the names but any groupset not of those three are out for me.

So that’s that. PM? I wonder if there is a difference between them really. Whatever one is the most reliable and accurate, convenient too but only if it’s reliable and accurate without question first. I would t take convenient over the other two.

Seat? Those S-Works ones seem good, but hard to say. Pro, fixing, any of those should be alright. I wouldn’t let that d’sel’italia blah blah blah anywhere near my bike tho.

Jerez is this blending in or turning into a different topic?
 
Mar 10, 2014
453
138
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Funabashi, Chiba
#5
Ok well back to this.

Groupsets? Saddles? That’s just the sunglasses or sneakers on your bike from the outsiders perspective - I’ve said before it was personally difficult to tell the difference between DA and even 105 once you spend a little time on the road, so if you’re not racing or trying to build a climbing machine or something you’re really thinking more about aesthetics or cool factor than pure performance..

But the frame? Well that’s basically what our brains register as “your bike”. Nobody answers “What do you got?” With “I ride DA”

So the frame. This is what holds everything together and what makes your bike rideable or not.

I can’t tell the difference between a carbon frame or a steel frame or an aluminum frame, unless there are vast differences in weight or stiffness. Even stiffness is difficult to gauge unless you try to do hard bursts and even then if your tires are under inflated or if your wheels are squishy it’s going to feel pretty bad even if the frame is decent. How heavy you are also make a huge difference in how a frame behaves - but I’m not speaking from a position of authority or particular knowledge or insight, it’s just my current understanding based on be experience I have.

So as far as frame goes, I would pick one that’s the right size of course, a good color, is within an acceptable weight, and has an appealing geometry (at least to me)

The order would be size, weight, color, geometry, material and then all the rest (marketing bs, gimmicks, etc)

No real allegiance to brands or materials. They’re all pretty?

I’m not sold on the aero or not aero idea I don’t think I’m going fast enough and I don’t think I’m ever in situations where it matters enough to give aero or not aero serious thought. I’d pick the one I liked. Like if you’re down to the point where aero is going to make the difference you’re probably riding something you have to ride anyways because that’s the one your sponsor and team mechanic prepared for you on that day.

But as humans we do love to emulate, copy so well there’s that I suppose. Nothing wrong with it either to a point.

edit: ok now is see it really is getting redundant what I’m writing here. Oh well. Knee deep already so keep going I guess
 
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Mar 10, 2014
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Funabashi, Chiba
#9
Mar 10, 2014
453
138
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Funabashi, Chiba
#11
ok... so carrying on.

Frames. I ddin't mention a pretty critical thing before in the list of priorities when choosing, ,and that would be price. I think in this case choosing your frame, and here is where I think I'm getting confused with N bike and dream bike because the two territories start to come pretty close together here. I think by dream bike we should maybe think of it as something maybe a little out of reach at least, by rarity, exclusivity, price, something that puts it out of reach making it truly a "dream" bike. So as far as your N..

For example, I don't think I could consider a SPECIALIZED tarmac frame my N bike frame. It would have to be S-WORKS. It just would. It couldn't be a derosa idol, it would have to be a Protos. I know I said an SL6 would be in dream bike territory, but it isn't. It's N bike terrritory. That would be the upper reaches of it for me. Beyond that, well it's beyond.

Anyways back to price. Price will cloud your judgement when it comes to choosing a frame I believe. For me personoally I would choose the top three leaving price out of it first so you know which you really want, then consider the crazy cash dolla dolla you're gonna have to lay down there for the man. If you can do it, do it. You never leave your N locked up oustide or out of sight for more than a second, if that.

Anything Im missing here? lWhat is this turning into, a term report??

On to wheels.

Conti gp2000, no real need to venture off from that every time I've used other tires they flatted for one thing, with way more frequency, and who need that bullshit, and as far as rolling resistance, that's wack shit as far as I"m concerned. I guess I buy into the fatter tire thing for now, but 25c is still the biggest tired I've felt for a while. Maybe try 28c next time round though.

Wheels. This is the other important thing about your bike, but a bit like "mag wheels" lmao I know it's "rims" now or ARUMI in Japan - they can make or break the look of your car and it doesn't toally depend on how good they are or how shitty. I believe wheels will change the performance of your bike more than a frame will though.

Something like BORA, expensive, popular in Japan, can't fault them really, but nah. Fulcrum, double naaah. MAVIC? I've been using some iteration of MAVIC wheels for years now, no problems but low on the coolness / exotic factor. But acceptable for me. DA wheels, again, acceptable but only just. BONTRAGER have got to have the single most shittiest logo design in the history of logos. Don't kno wif they're good but wow they look cheap and crappy. ENVE? Want but tough call on the price.. Would need to balance out the ratio between frame and whieels in this case. I think it might be worth it to lowball the frame a bit to make room for the ENVE wheelset but hmm.

Here's a question, Whato do you think of those OEM ROVAL wheels ? I actually have got a line on a slightly reduced set of those - very conservatively marked up with graphics, probably pretty good wheels, made by DT SWISS I think - I think I might be able to hack those on my N bike.

Wow going on a bit again. Cut it off here.
 

Musashi13

Maximum Pace
Aug 27, 2012
1,761
1,100
143
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Ichikawa, Chiba
#12
You’re sticking with the meat and veg of standard road food. What wrong with the exotic?
You have the dream, money isn’t an object. We all ignore the wife, the kids, the gas and electricity bills, eat broccoli and brown rice for a bit then it’s all within reach!
Sub 5kg aero maniac that can swap out 650B and handle 3 bottle cages?
You’re going with what’s hanging up in your high street Y’s Road. Your head’s not in the clouds it’s in the marketing.


Oh, wait! We’re in the what would I only just bother riding thread.

Anything I can afford is what I would categorise as what I would just about bother riding. Anything above that is where the questions start.

I’ll leave that for a later post as our OP seems to be doing a good job on this stream of consciousness cycling purchase dos and don’ts.
 
Mar 10, 2014
453
138
73
Funabashi, Chiba
#13
You’re sticking with the meat and veg of standard road food. What wrong with the exotic?
You have the dream, money isn’t an object. We all ignore the wife, the kids, the gas and electricity bills, eat broccoli and brown rice for a bit then it’s all within reach!
Sub 5kg aero maniac that can swap out 650B and handle 3 bottle cages?
You’re going with what’s hanging up in your high street Y’s Road. Your head’s not in the clouds it’s in the marketing.


Oh, wait! We’re in the what would I only just bother riding thread.

Anything I can afford is what I would categorise as what I would just about bother riding. Anything above that is where the questions start.

I’ll leave that for a later post as our OP seems to be doing a good job on this stream of consciousness cycling purchase dos and don’ts.
Oh yes we’re definitly in the high street Y’s Road zone here, absolutely - you’ve as usual pegged it with much more clarity and much faster than I would have on my own, it really is the cash, what we can afford that draws the line between (N) as I’m putting it and (dream). My situation places me firmly at Y’s, not even trying to peep over the fence. Not even near the fence! Not even Y’s?? Could it actually be the ASAHI Cycles I should be wandering into, that sea of fluorescent lit Bridgestone? (Not hating on Bridgestone, poor old Bridgestone tho). Oh while we’re on that, hating on stuff I mean, there’s really no excuse for purchasing an ANCHOR frame. Just say no. Panasonic, on the other hand, holds a special place in my heart.

But as I’ve droned on about already, I think bike stuff is way over priced. Especially the more you approach the mass marketing high end. Such is such.

So where was I. Wheels, tubeless, naah on that too, too much hassle (thanks to those who offered advice info on that)

Disk brakes. This is something worth doing. There is definitly a performance benefit there and it’s worth it, my attitude has changed regarding this topic over the last year or so. No disks, not a deal breaker (starting to HATE that phrase don’t know why... oh hate us such a vulgar word too I should be ashamed)
I would probably steer clear of weird frames with direct mount under the BB type stuff etc.

So stem, seatpost, well who gives a fuck really.. just not too heavy / shitty looking - well most off the rack modern frames at the higher end come with those anyways these days - I’m not a big fan of those massive chunky stems like the ones sprinters use..

Oh maybe this is a topic for its own thread - does anybody know what’s going on with those RECMOUNT um, mounts?? There’s like 40,000 things it seems on last time I looked their “Welcome to the internet it’s 1998” webpage - and in tiny pictures I can’t figure out the writing so I don’t understand compatibility but something that holds your computer, a light, a camera if you want sounds kind of nice.. Anyone know about those / own something g from them?
 
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wexford

Maximum Pace
Jul 3, 2012
982
594
113
Tokyo
#14
One problem with N=1 is that if the bike is too good, then you have to think twice about using it sometimes. How about a ride to the park to hang out with friends for a picnic? Maybe a run to the shops, a commute to work, a visit to a mates, or even to a bike shop where you have to leave your bike locked somewhere out of sight for a period of time. Maybe it's pissing rain, you want to ride a quick 20k but you'd rather than get your pride and joy all mucky (unless of course it's that kind of bike). N has to be at least 2 if your bike is too expensive, no? That said, I only have 1 bike in Japan. I know I need 1 more though. Actually, I think I need 2 more. My 4 year old has 2 bikes, 3 if you count the strider... Hmmm.
 
Mar 10, 2014
453
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Funabashi, Chiba
#16
One problem with N=1 is that if the bike is too good, then you have to think twice about using it sometimes. How about a ride to the park to hang out with friends for a picnic? Maybe a run to the shops, a commute to work, a visit to a mates, or even to a bike shop where you have to leave your bike locked somewhere out of sight for a period of time. Maybe it's pissing rain, you want to ride a quick 20k but you'd rather than get your pride and joy all mucky (unless of course it's that kind of bike). N has to be at least 2 if your bike is too expensive, no? That said, I only have 1 bike in Japan. I know I need 1 more though. Actually, I think I need 2 more. My 4 year old has 2 bikes, 3 if you count the strider... Hmmm.
Yeah - you can go halfway and try to make your N, (assuming the situation is for whatever reason you can only have one bike, and this is the one you need to be able to take out on proper rides and take out in sketchy weather / social functions) but then you're starting to go all the way down to 105 for a groupset and a lower than mid level frame, and the game is totally different.

Not the best anology but how often do you see (high grade, late model or valuable classic) Porsche 911's parked at supermarkets or the park? Almost never right. I think the basic idea is if you're going to have a car like that, you're going to use it accordingly or, you're going to get a run of the mill used Subaru Impreza or something that you can use as the family truckster and speed around a little bit in as well. Or have the Porsche and a Kei (mamachari) that's not good for any kind of driving at all but functional for those other things. But again the game here is no +1.

My approach here has been the taking the one impractical ride as your one bike one, but we can do the other way too as we go.

For me this is almost the perfect bike, - light, pretty aero, disc brakes, eTap etc. Unlike Canyon, when ordering you can spec. things up yourself, ie crank length, stem length, bar width etc. The only downside I see is the rather uninspiring appearance, which is very important admittedly...

https://www.rosebikes.co.uk/rose-x-lite-six-disc-etap-2661717
Interesting never heard of ROSE - I like the black carbon (matte?) look of it. Does it actually have asymetric decaling or are those separate colorways? Massive head tube on that - maybe like the 57cm in the pic? I wonder what the 53 looks like. Thanks for the link tho!
 
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dastott

Speeding Up
May 10, 2012
66
12
28
Fukuoka
#17
By the way, there is nothing wrong with Shimano 105. Some lower budget pro teams use it when they race against World Tour pro teams. So if it is good enough for them it is more than enough for amateurs like us...