Garmin Edge 800

4s44

Warming-Up
Dec 11, 2012
4
0
0
Yokohama
#1
I am getting the Garmin edge 800 this year for Christmas, and I had a question about it. I have heard that the base maps, are ok, but that they are missing some of the real power and aesthetic of the purchasable sd cards for it. I decided that instead of going out and using 20000¥ on a sd card right of the bat, I would first try one of the online free maps, such as the openstreetmaps. But I was wondering whether the base version of the Garmin edge 800 comes with an sd card, or if I have to go out and buy one myself, and whether that is sufficient for it to work on my garmin edge 800. Also if you prefer one online map service over another then please tell me.
 

knownone

Speeding Up
Aug 4, 2011
138
5
38
Tokyo
jeremyscofield.ca
#2
I am getting the Garmin edge 800 this year for Christmas, and I had a question about it. I have heard that the base maps, are ok, but that they are missing some of the real power and aesthetic of the purchasable sd cards for it. I decided that instead of going out and using 20000¥ on a sd card right of the bat, I would first try one of the online free maps, such as the openstreetmaps. But I was wondering whether the base version of the Garmin edge 800 comes with an sd card, or if I have to go out and buy one myself, and whether that is sufficient for it to work on my garmin edge 800. Also if you prefer one online map service over another then please tell me.
The base maps depend on which edition of Edge 800 you are getting. If your are getting an Edge 800J it will have good maps for Japan built-in, but if you are buying another edition you will most likely need to get base maps elsewhere. Openstreetmaps can be good for a lot of countries, but unfortunately it does not have the same accuracy for Japan as the Garmin maps or UpUpDown (which can be purchased on a micro-SD card or downloaded and installed).

Do you know which version of Edge 800 you will be getting?
 

4s44

Warming-Up
Dec 11, 2012
4
0
0
Yokohama
#3
I am getting an imported cadence and heart meter version, I know how I should fix the entire kanji problem already. My family found it 30% off on a website with free shipping. So I am not getting the 800J. I am primarily riding around the Kanagawa area, are the maps bad in this area on openstreetmaps as well? Do you know if there is a store where I can get the UpUpDown sd card, if the other maps are not as good?
 

theDude

Maximum Pace
Oct 7, 2011
773
111
63
Tokyo
app.strava.com
#4
UpUpDown is via a web site. Google can help.

800 did not come with a microSD. The full Japan map from UUD does not fit on the 800 without an SD card.

I am not sure of the size options available for the UUD SD option, might be worth checking in case you put other stuff on there. I have a couple different map files for other countries on it that I move around. Haven't looked into a way for all of them to just work, so I rename files around if traveling.
 

knownone

Speeding Up
Aug 4, 2011
138
5
38
Tokyo
jeremyscofield.ca
#5
I am getting an imported cadence and heart meter version, I know how I should fix the entire kanji problem already. My family found it 30% off on a website with free shipping. So I am not getting the 800J. I am primarily riding around the Kanagawa area, are the maps bad in this area on openstreetmaps as well? Do you know if there is a store where I can get the UpUpDown sd card, if the other maps are not as good?
If you get an SD card from UUD (UpUpDown) it uses romanized characters so you do not need a kanji fix (I could not find a kanji fix that actually worked on the most recent Edge 800 firmware). I have been using the V4 of their maps and have found it generally accurate. When I tried OpenStreetMaps for Japan last summer I found that the roads were sometimes a bit off, but that might have changed more recently. OpenStreetMaps can also be difficult if you can't display kanji on your Edge 800 and the searches do not really work. UUD let's you search for Japanese locations by postal code or romanized names (although that can sometimes be difficult if you are not sure of the reading of an unfamiliar kanji name).

I am not sure about other TCC members who use the Edge 800 in Japan (and I would be interested to hear about an alternative) but I find that UUD seems to be the best option on imported Edge 800's.
 

4s44

Warming-Up
Dec 11, 2012
4
0
0
Yokohama
#6
Yeah, I was planning on just having individual sd cards for the countries that I will be in, so that is the least of my worries right now. I am just looking for a temporary solution to start with, before I decide on which proper mapping service I choose. Does a normal SD card work, or it is a micro SD or something? And is there a maximum acceptable card size in the Garmin Edge 800?
 

knownone

Speeding Up
Aug 4, 2011
138
5
38
Tokyo
jeremyscofield.ca
#7
I got the download version from UUD and installed it on an 8GB microSD card myself since I also keep Canada and US maps on my device. If you do keep multiple maps on your MicroSD card, the Edge 800 usually runs more smoothly if you turn off unneeded maps.

The Edge 800 does not really have enough local memory to handle any wide-area map, although you can sometimes carry maps for specific cities in the local memory.
 

knownone

Speeding Up
Aug 4, 2011
138
5
38
Tokyo
jeremyscofield.ca
#9
Yeah, I was planning on just having individual sd cards for the countries that I will be in, so that is the least of my worries right now. I am just looking for a temporary solution to start with, before I decide on which proper mapping service I choose. Does a normal SD card work, or it is a micro SD or something? And is there a maximum acceptable card size in the Garmin Edge 800?
The Garmin Edge 800 uses MicroSD cards. According to Garmin:

It is recommended a standard speed card, no larger than 32 GB, be used in order to get the best performance from the device. Class 4 to Class 10 is considered standard speed. (http://goo.gl/pcSrM)
So up to a 32GB card should be ok.
 

Musashi13

Maximum Pace
Aug 27, 2012
1,775
1,106
143
41
Ichikawa, Chiba
#11
I got a Garmin 800 just a few weeks ago and bought the UUD Japan maps and put them on a 8GB micro SD myself. All works fine though I am still getting used to it and all its myriad functions.

I wanted to try some free maps too but in the end just paid.
 

4s44

Warming-Up
Dec 11, 2012
4
0
0
Yokohama
#12
Thank you all so much for the info so far. Kind of a funny question, but are there any quirks or hidden features that I should be aware of when I start using it or is it all pretty self explanatory?
 

Musashi13

Maximum Pace
Aug 27, 2012
1,775
1,106
143
41
Ichikawa, Chiba
#14
I went for the full topo version without the card as it looked like they charge ¥2,000 for the card. Bought an 8GB card for a few hundred yen. The version I bought is linked in my post earlier and takes up 3+GB of the card.
 
Sep 2, 2009
5
0
0
#15
Sweet. Perhaps a dumb question, but what exactly does the Topo part add to everything? I realise this is going to be some kind of topographical element, but how does it show up in practice?

Also, installing it to your MicroSD card; is it just a case of copying the files over, or do you need to image it onto the sd card or whatever?

Cheers
 

Musashi13

Maximum Pace
Aug 27, 2012
1,775
1,106
143
41
Ichikawa, Chiba
#16
There are instructions on the site on how to transfer it and it was very straight forward. I had installed all Garmin drivers and additional software before downloading the UUD maps.

As for the difference, I do not feel in anyway qualified to answer that and in hindsight it could have been a bit of a waste getting that particular version, though I am not sure.

When viewed through software on the PC the topographical detail is visible but I am not sure the 800 takes it into account in any way. I am ready to stand corrected on that point but to the untrained eye it cannot be readily seen...
 
May 22, 2007
3,612
1,445
143
Kawasaki
halffastcycling.com
#17
what exactly does the Topo part add to everything? I realise this is going to be some kind of topographical element, but how does it show up in practice?

Also, installing it to your MicroSD card; is it just a case of copying the files over, or do you need to image it onto the sd card or whatever?

Cheers
When viewed through software on the PC the topographical detail is visible but I am not sure the 800 takes it into account in any way. I am ready to stand corrected on that point but to the untrained eye it cannot be readily seen...
I download the full version and install it using MapSource, which I run in VMware. Doing it this way is the most flexible. I can make multiple cards containing different map sets. The more maps you have stuffed into a card, the longer routing calculations an redraws take.

The topo information on the map is (just) a set of altitude data points. The Edge can use this to draw contour lines on the map display, and you can also check the altitude of any point on the map. Because I grew up with Bartholomew and then Ordnance Survey maps, I like having contour lines so I can see what's coming up ahead and how much pain/fun it's likely to be.

The topo information does not inform the altimeter, which works by combining GPS information and the internal barometric altimeter.
 
May 22, 2007
3,612
1,445
143
Kawasaki
halffastcycling.com
#19
Please elaborate on this.
Sure.

Maps for Garmin devices consist of a grid of rectangular cells. They overlap slightly. One or more cells, saved as a single file, is called a Map Set. The Map Set may contain road and Point of Interest (POI) information only, or it may optionally also contain altitude data and routing data.

proxy.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fimageshack.us%2Fa%2Fimg5%2F1742%2Fmapsource1.th.jpg&hash=7ff2b4b46ae39b8d298b9016f4c8500d


The image linked above shows Garmin Mapsource with the UUD4 road+topo map loaded. The individual cells display as grey rectangles. I have selected a group of cells around the Kanto area. They're coloured red. This is where I do the vast majority of my riding.

In the sidebar you can see the list of selected cells and their size. Because this is the road+topo version of the product, each cell, e.g. the first one, cell 52390, is associated with a digital road map (DRM) dataset and a topological (TOPO) dataset. I also have the route calculation data option selected.

The total memory required for this Map Set is 191.8 MB. This won't fit in the Edge 800 without a microSD card, because the available internal memory is only around 75 MB. So I still need to save this Map Set to a card.

A preprogrammed card from UpUpDown contains a Map Set comprising all the cells with their DRM, TOPO and route calculation data, which is about 10 times the volume of data in the Map Set I have illustrated.

It has been my experience that using a smaller Map Set speeds up the screen redraws when riding across the boundaries between cells, and significantly reduces the amount of time needed to calculate routes on the fly. I guess that because there is less data on the card for the Edge's processor to hunt through, it works faster/better.

This may seem unnecessarily nerdy. Well... you did ask me to elaborate. I like the flexibility. So I have a small µSD card with this Map Set that I use most of the time, and a separate, larger µSD card with the whole of Japan on that I keep in a baggie.

If you buy the precompiled maps on a card, you cannot unpack them into Mapsource. But on the other hand you don't need to use Mapsource at all - just plug and play.
 

theDude

Maximum Pace
Oct 7, 2011
773
111
63
Tokyo
app.strava.com
#20
I download the full version and install it using MapSource, which I run in VMware. Doing it this way is the most flexible. I can make multiple cards containing different map sets. The more maps you have stuffed into a card, the longer routing calculations an redraws take.

The topo information on the map is (just) a set of altitude data points. The Edge can use this to draw contour lines on the map display, and you can also check the altitude of any point on the map. Because I grew up with Bartholomew and then Ordnance Survey maps, I like having contour lines so I can see what's coming up ahead and how much pain/fun it's likely to be.

The topo information does not inform the altimeter, which works by combining GPS information and the internal barometric altimeter.
altimeter: The 800 I believe takes the altitude on startup based on location, then goes barometric.


Mike, how do you get multiple maps on one card? I rename files to make it work, depending on what country I'm in (i only have 3 sets of maps, so no major drama). Can i just have it read whatever? that would be easier. i don't care so much about the actual maps, i don't use that so often.