DIY Wheels Lacing Jig

StuInTokyo

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#1
The other day I was over at Tim's helping him build the back wheel for my Mixer, I realized that if you were doing this a lot, a lacing jig would sure make the job easier and more fun.

I've found next to no information on the web.....

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A very basic jig, the problem I see with this is that getting the spokes into the holes in the hub would be a hassel, they would hit the table top

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I think this one is very nice, looks like a DIY fabricated lacing jig very similar to the Bringheli comercial jig, nice job!

Then there is the > Bringheli Lacing Jig <
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Not exactly the best pic, maybe the maker does not wish his design copied?
The price is $250 US and it looks like a very good piece of kit!

I did find one better pic of the jig...
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Then I found this pic from the Shimano wheel factory....
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Wow, that is some set up! :eek:

Article >> HERE << on the tour of the factory.

OK what have I come up with....?

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Understand it is a Work In Progress, I'm not quite done yet.

I need to add the four legs that will hold up the rim, they will have two points of attachemnt, one for 700C rims and one for 26" rims, and I guess more holes could be drilled for even smaller rims. I'm thinking that the legs will be similar to the ones on the green lacing jig above, mainly because I do not know inside diameter of the rim to be used, but I will know the outside diameter, that is set, isn't it? The profile of each rim can be very different from a very basic light non-aero rim to a big aero rim.

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The center post adjusts up and down so you can set the dish of the rim if you like, or at least get it close, depending on the hub you are using, front or back, fixie or MTB. There is the nut end of a quick release squewer in the center post, and I will have some spacers to make up the thickness of the forks or the dropouts. The other end of the center post is drilled for solid axle hubs, like my Alfine 8.

It all breaks down into fairly small componets, which is important in Japan.
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The lenght of the steel pipe can be changed once we figue out a good height for it. I can clamp the cleat on the bottom of the square piece of plywood in my vice, Tim can clamp it into his workmate that he uses as a bench.

I think with will work well, should make the whole process a bit easier.

Thoughts?
 

StuInTokyo

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#3
I think I love it when you decide to build something and I get an interesting thread to read. :)
Thanks much! :D

OK, I think this is basically done, I need to get it to Tim to give it a test run.....

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I think it will work fine, I understand why the other stands have only three support arms, similar to why a milking stool has only three legs, that and less stuff to get in the way of the spokes.

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It is adjustable for the 700C or 26" wheels.

Tim are you around tomorrow, or out riding, I could run it over and see what you think...?

Cheers!
 

GSAstuto

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#5
Excellent, Stu! Very close to the concept I was thinking. If we can make the 'cross' colapsable - then it will store easily too. Just clamp it in the workmate and ready to go!

Notice the Shimano assy line - they first spoke all the hubs, then transfer them to the lacing station where they are fited with nipples, then the truing station.
 

StuInTokyo

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#6
Excellent, Stu! Very close to the concept I was thinking. If we can make the 'cross' colapsable - then it will store easily too. Just clamp it in the workmate and ready to go!

Notice the Shimano assy line - they first spoke all the hubs, then transfer them to the lacing station where they are fited with nipples, then the truing station.
The cross is colapsable :D

Are you around this afternoon? I'll drop by and let you have a look:D
 

joewein

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#9
Notice the Shimano assy line - they first spoke all the hubs, then transfer them to the lacing station where they are fited with nipples, then the truing station.
I'm a little surprised at Shimano this still involves that much manual labour and they don't have robots to do this yet, not even at individual stations of the whole process.

A year and a half ago I visited a Yamaha factory in Shizuoka prefecture where they make grand pianos. They had a piano tuning robot that would hit the keys while twisting the tensioning nuts for the piano strings and checking the result with computerized microphones. The machine tunes several keys an octave apart in parallel, so it is all incredibly quick. The final tuning is still done by a human though. I can see some parallels between tensioning spokes / truing a wheel and tensioning piano wire / checking the sound from a key. I guess it's only a matter of time when it will happen.
 

jdd

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#10
Piano tuning is a whole 'nother can of worms, and while it might be on first thought mildly analogous to wheel-building, it really isn't. At all.

The human ear and the mathematical stuff about intervals differs ever so slightly, that an equal-tempered instrument can take one or another means to deliver that "equal" tempered tuning that will supposedly sound 'okay' to humans. There were any number of different 'tempered' tunings, before the present bastardization was arrived at.

Vocal (a capella) groups ignore the multi-key adjustments and sing perfectly in tune for whatever key they might be in.

Fretted instruments like a guitar have a hard time of it, a guitarist's touch can vary the fretted tone a little so that it becomes more real, but a piano player cannot. But if a guitarist tunes to, and plays, in a single key, it can sound really nice.

No doubt yamaha has it figured out as well as anyone, but google stretch tuning for how people/tuners adjust the theoretical to perception.

If you're always going to be playing in one key, no problem. But if you also want to bounce around between keys, you're going to have to compromise.

Wind chimes sound nice, because they're perfectly tuned to one key, they never have to 'play' in any other
 

StuInTokyo

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#11
Don't know anything about pianos besides they are heavy :D

I got this lacing jig done, well a beta version, or a Ver. 1.0

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I happened to have some blue spray paint on hand.

It breaks down really easy......

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... so it does not take up much precious space.

Tim has it now and reports back with good feedback, I need to put some slippery tape, or some UHMW pieces on the "L" shaped rim supports, and a tilt function would be good, that way you can sit on a stool and build your wheels. I think it will also be a good idea to have an arm attached to the steel post with tray on it for tools and parts.

Now Tim will use this lacing jig for a while and then we will work on Ver 1.1 etc.

Cheers!
 

joewein

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#16
Don't know anything about pianos besides they are heavy :D
Being largely made from wood (including the most important part, the sound board), building pianos is mostly high grade furniture making :)

Yamaha reminded me of Shimano: bigger volume with high efficiency, while Kawai (and a couple of others) are more like Campagnolo: more expensive and more traditional. It was very interesting for me to watch the mass production of something much older in design than the bicycle.


Piano tuning is a whole 'nother can of worms, and while it might be on first thought mildly analogous to wheel-building, it really isn't. At all.
So what you're saying is that piano tuning is a lot more complex than wheel building, yet there already is a robot for it. I don't know where Shimano builds its wheels, but they have a lot of production in Malaysia and China, whereas Japanese grand pianos are still made by Japanese craftsmen, mostly in Shizuoka. The wage level may have something to do with why one is partly mechanized and the other is not.


Anyway, good job, Stu! This should be very helpful to Tim.
 

GSAstuto

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#18
Thanks, Stu - this is working out very well! Just a couple of small tweaks and it will be perfect!

BTW - here's the state of the art for automated tools - -http://www.hollandmechanics.com/

But still - a machine cannot tune a wheel perfectly because the variations are just too many. Like tuning a piano - you need to balance the 'tuning' not only against the desired pitch, but also soundboard resonances and discrepency of wire. On a wheel you are looking at how to achieve perfectly consistent spoke tension and 2 axis truing. Bearing in mind that each spoke/nipple/hub/rimhole combination is a little different. Then, on top of that, each rimset will have its own 'sweet spot' - and to find that is really just a matter of feel.
 

Tamir

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#19
Tim has it now and reports back with good feedback, I need to put some slippery tape, or some UHMW pieces on the "L" shaped rim supports, and a tilt function would be good, that way you can sit on a stool and build your wheels. I think it will also be a good idea to have an arm attached to the steel post with tray on it for tools and parts.

Now Tim will use this lacing jig for a while and then we will work on Ver 1.1 etc.

Cheers!
Don't forget the cupholder and sandwich tray.:D
 

jdd

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#20
Next time, how about a modified "t" instead of an X, for three point support instead of four?

Still could be disassembled, and I guess axle/hub support would then not be centered over the base (unless that, too, moved).

??

You folks are waaayy ahead of me on most everything, so if this is a**-backwards for some reason, please understand....!